Models' fees

£22 might be the going rate for 2 butties and 2 brews in Croydon, but up here in Oldham, folks would no more pay that than fly to the moon. I strongly suspect that we also see some regionality in what models wish to charge and what photographers wish to pay. If this has already been raised, apologies, CBA wading through all ten pages. :)

Huw said

Lenswonder said

The Ghost of Prancy McPrettykins 'but the levels expected of a 'nude model' are almost always higher on the continent.'

Would you mind adding more to this , do models on the continent work harder perhaps? Just so we can get a better picture of what you mean.

Very big smiles.

Down below.

They don't call it "continental" for nowt.

I always wonder if a model is having a quiet time, no work for a few days or a week that they aren't more pro-active? They could offer discounts, 3 for 2 hours or similar offers. I know some do, but in these straitened times surely it's best for more models to do similar and to have something coming in rather than nowt? Or, would this ruin their future income in better times?

Byron said

I always wonder if a model is having a quiet time, no work for a few days or a week that they aren't more pro-active? They could offer discounts, 3 for 2 hours or similar offers. I know some do, but in these straitened times surely it's best for more models to do similar and to have something coming in rather than nowt? Or, would this ruin their future income in better times?

Some certainly do.

My freelance gigs are typically quite long but you use the time off to catch up on admin, put your name about, chase up people who might have work for you, do those interesting projects that can't pay etc. I suspect some models could sell their weekends 3 times over but mid-week is quieter, so I'd suggest maybe charging extra for weekends and midweek discounts. We do see postings of "my diary looks empty, so for a limited time I'm offering..."  You do get offers of things for insulting amounts of money, and experience tells me that clients who take the piss over your fee take the piss with everything else and they're the ones to avoid. And sometimes someone you feel like supporting wants something and you it for nothing. Limited discounts and opting not to be paid for specific jobs doesn't kill revenue for the future, although no-one wants to be known for working for free. 

Stu H said

Afrofilmviewer

[Snip]

But again it does come down to the age old dilemma of whom should get paid - the photographer or the model?????"

[Snip]

Why should a model pay me so I can continue my hobby?

If I played golf (I dont), or used a gym (I dont) I would have to pay membership fees and usage feed... so why shouldn't a model be compensated for their time?

If they are going to post the images to the likes of OF and charge people to view - why not pass a bit back to the people that help create the images? Keeps everyone happy...

11 pages and everyone has used all their effort to make a point they want heard…….. as a photographer.  

But the most valuable, relevant and pertinent comment has been passed over. So maybe all photographers should now stop commenting and just keep re-posting this comment. This way, we may actually learn something useful: 

quote FROM A MODEL

“One thing that is very evident from this thread, is that a lot of people are struggling right now, and a minority doing well.

From a model's perspective, the overheads have increased. For example, to keep getting my nails done in a salon I now have to fork out £45 every 2 to 4 weeks, where as about 8 months ago it used to be £30ish, luckily I don't dye my hair so I don't have to fork out hundreds on that every couple of months (for my length of hair I have been quoted hundreds in every salon), but of course there are other beauty treatments which I pay for to keep myself in top shape for my clients - in a cheap month that comes to £150ish, which isn't cheap at all.

Yes you could argue I could stop, but then that would have an impact on my appearance, which is how I make my living at present. My rent has increased by £50 p.m, not even going to mention gas and electricity...I tried absorbing those costs myself for a while last year without raising prices, but then it gets to the point where it's not sustainable, so my hourly needs to increase.

To keep my wardrobe updated for fashion shoots,it costs so much more than it used to, so naturally even the fashion rate had to come up.

I find that there are photographers out there who are genuinely struggling just as I am, and I am always willing to negotiate if someone approaches me nicely and honestly, but there are always those who never wanted to pay full rates in the first place, even if they could. They tend to want to shoot fetish and see the most flesh, it gets tiring.

I've been blessed to work with many wonderful photographers, but equally, I feel exasperated with those who want much for little in return”.

Edited by Glamourportraits

Glamourportraits thank you for bringing it up, I did feel I got completely ignored. I can't speak for all models of course, but I'm sure it's similar with overheads for many across the board. Times are tough for majority and the rates aren't increasing due to greed.

Sandra Blu said

Orson Carter I agree with you BUT your logic fails when sites for hobbyists in US and EU models are charging double and triple, why?

Base costs for the USA are different. 

The EU countries vary in healthcare costs, insurance etc, but direct charges or additional insurance seem common. 

The USA economy seems to be going very well, the EU ones well, ours...not so much.

And the EU countries tend to have less stratification - income inequality - than we do.

Jon Taylor said

“Many of us (photographers) have enjoyed massive pay rises over the last couple of years (for example, junior doctors are hoping to get 35%), State pensions are index-linked”

Try working in adult social care. Massive pay rises? You jest, of course. And right now, the State pension is helping me keep the heating and lights on. 
As a hobbyist photographer, with the Cost of Living right now I can either negotiate with models or just not shoot at all. It isn’t just models who may be struggling. 

Perfectly put.

Lenswonder said

I think the wealthy photographers are already doing their thing , spending big money sometimes on very mediocre models. Those that are not wealthy are doing their best to shoot with who they can. It needs no more encouragement for fees to go up. It will only screw the non wealthy.

Truth.

Retouchguy said

the only thing to be achieved by raising fees is pricing poorer people out of the game, but then models would need to raise fees more to compensate for less people booking them which would price more out the game then the dominoes keep falling till were all using AI models for free and models move full time to only fans and admire me. 

Only a matter of time before AI models make models redundant on those sites...

Amazeballs said

Lenswonder said

I think the wealthy photographers are already doing their thing , spending big money sometimes on very mediocre models. Those that are not wealthy are doing their best to shoot with who they can. It needs no more encouragement for fees to go up. It will only screw the non wealthy.

Truth.

+1

I don't think AI is going to take over to that extent.

There's still a big USP in a picture that's captured a real situation that the recreation by an AI model will never achieve.

JamesMt142 said

I don't think AI is going to take over to that extent.

There's still a big USP in a picture that's captured a real situation that the recreation by an AI model will never achieve.

to be honest i think it will be a while, however there are AI model agencies already, and you can already create 3d ai models, add backgrounds all that jazz its just not realistic enough yet but its come a long way in just 8 months, imagine what it'll be like in a year or two years. i predict that in 5 - 10 years you will be able to show ai a photo you took and it will be able to create the exact replica as a 3d controllable environment with 360 camera and light control the works , if you think its never going to happen then you've not been paying attention. 

There are around 7 agencies i can see at this standard, pretty realistic, what will they be like in a year or two

https://www.creativebloq.com/news/ai-model-agency 

Edited by Retouchguy

I'm not saying it's not going to happen. I'm saying that there will be market for photographs of something that actually happened.

If the models go AI there won't be photography. Think about it.