Models' fees

😱😱Gosh there’s some angry photographers on here 😱😱

Off Beat Image if I was getting paid £30 an hour working 37hrs a week I’d be laughing.

Day job pays £11 an hour. And can involve saving someone’s life. Pretty sad eh?

Jessica Knight 100% 😁 I think for me I would love to pay models. But my income doesn’t allow for that luxury. I shoot for my own outlet from life, for my mental health and to satisfy the itch to do something a bit creative.

I do however treat all collaborations as a professional shoot and try my best to create something that the model likes too 😁

Retouchguy said

CalmNudes said

 

 paying, shooting what you're told, putting additional time in to edit it, and then letting someone else sell it without sharing the proceeds isn't attractive to many people. 

Rubbish  search model casting in Scotland right now i guarantee you will find a few paid casting from models that tell you the theme they want, the style, the date etc and then you will see they all have OF or AM accounts where the images are for, the point of tf is to get mutual required images (Non commercial) technically models should legally pay for that 

For pity's sake. Just because a model puts out a casting asking for the moon on a stick doesn't mean anyone has to accept.  The castings exist. Do they get replies?  Are the replies worth having. 

What do you mean technically they should legally pay.  Shouldn't pay illegally ? In your view (and mine) it's equitable for someone whose work is sold to get paid for it, but if an Only Fanny performer can get someone who wanks over her pictures to shoot some and pay for it, isn't that just a hygienic kind of sex work with a sellable by-product?  You and I aren't in the market for that but if some people who hang out on PP are ... 

CalmNudes said

Retouchguy said

CalmNudes said

 

 paying, shooting what you're told, putting additional time in to edit it, and then letting someone else sell it without sharing the proceeds isn't attractive to many people. 

Rubbish  search model casting in Scotland right now i guarantee you will find a few paid casting from models that tell you the theme they want, the style, the date etc and then you will see they all have OF or AM accounts where the images are for, the point of tf is to get mutual required images (Non commercial) technically models should legally pay for that 

For pity's sake. Just because a model puts out a casting asking for the moon on a stick doesn't mean anyone has to accept.  The castings exist. Do they get replies?  Are the replies worth having. 

What do you mean technically they should legally pay.  Shouldn't pay illegally ? In your view (and mine) it's equitable for someone whose work is sold to get paid for it, but if an Only Fanny performer can get someone who wanks over her pictures to shoot some and pay for it, isn't that just a hygienic kind of sex work with a sellable by-product?  You and I aren't in the market for that but if some people who hang out on PP are ... 

and the same can be said for photographers and TF casting that theyre upset about 

Late to the party as always, but here are my thoughts

When I first joined the site the top models (shooting to nude) were charging about £35 p/h (with discounts for 4 hour shoots) and they are now charging around £50 p/h - so to the initial point rates have increased over time

At the same time studio hiring costs have increased - some have nearly doubled in price (understandably so, but it also impacts the hobby budget)

The market demand on PP is hobbyist photographers - this means market forces are impacted by how much disposable income people can afford to spend on a nice to have activity

So a four hour shoot with a top model used to cost me £170 / 180 it now costs me £290 - my disposable income to shoot hasn’t increased by £110

What this has meant to me, a photographer who does pay models for his shoots and doesn’t work TF, is that I have had to change my approach to shooting.  I now do fewer but bigger shoots (from shooting once a month, to shooting quarterly but for the full day) with my outlay being the same in total but spread over fewer shoots and therefore less models

 I know what I can afford to pay, and make a proposal direct to a model (normally with the option for them to have copies of any images I edit (not sure if that is a pro or a con)).  If what I can offer is not very near the rate of a model I want to shoot with I choose a different model E.g. if their rate is £50 p/h and I can only afford £35 p/h I probably won’t approach them (although I occasionally chance it)

It is then up to them to accept or reject (with no hard feelings from me)

In regards to TF - my personal opinion is a high percentage of TF offers do not benefit the model in anyway shape and form and are people just trying to get ‘free shoots’ and if I were a model I would avoid the majority of offers

I don’t begrudge paying models (the models I have shot with have all been worth the money I have paid), but unfortunately I can’t pay them as often anymore

Gothic Image said

Lenswonder said

Infinity Valerie address the fact that for some hobbyist photographers they have one job to fund a hobby. This hobby photographers pay for what apparently is your one job. With the many viable money making opportunities for models I find it hard to believe in this one job argument.

 

Oddly enough, I don't find it hard to believe at all.  For many models it is, as Infinity Valerie says, their only job and sole means of income.

It's bizarre that some people can't grasp these things. 

Lots of things we spend "luxury money" pay for someone's job.

I think he's saying models can sell content on porn sites, and so should charge less than the rate they would need to make a living if all they did was model. Which assumes if the market pays less than they need those sites aren't already enabling models to stay in business . And people still complain that there are models who make a lot via porn sites and therefore should work with amateur photographers for next to nothing' why does one follow from the other?  There seem to be a lot of iffy justifications for "I should be able to hire someone for a lower rate than they need to earn". 

CalmNudes said

Gothic Image said

Lenswonder said

Infinity Valerie address the fact that for some hobbyist photographers they have one job to fund a hobby. This hobby photographers pay for what apparently is your one job. With the many viable money making opportunities for models I find it hard to believe in this one job argument.

 

Oddly enough, I don't find it hard to believe at all.  For many models it is, as Infinity Valerie says, their only job and sole means of income.

It's bizarre that some people can't grasp these things. 

Lots of things we spend "luxury money" pay for someone's job.

I think he's saying models can sell content on porn sites, and so should charge less than the rate they would need to make a living if all they did was model. Which assumes if the market pays less than they need those sites aren't already enabling models to stay in business . And people still complain that there are models who make a lot via porn sites and therefore should work with amateur photographers for next to nothing' why does one follow from the other?  There seem to be a lot of iffy justifications for "I should be able to hire someone for a lower rate than they need to earn". 

TFP is an agreement to share time to create non commercial images for mutual portfolio creation , If a photographer pays a model then the model is not legally entitled to images and certainly is breaking the law using on OF or AM without permission from copyright holder (its copyright theft), Why are the model rights the only ones you're standing up for , photographer's have rights too 

If models want more money they should charge more its that simple, if they are worth it then they will get hired at that rate, all this debate about how much they're valued is pointless, people will only pay what they believe is fair at end of day, if a model over values themselves then they will get no work, if they undervalue themselves then they will lose money also. and since the cost of a shoot wildly changes by location then its very different for every model for instance a photographer in london will happily pay £40 for travel for a model, where i am we would be looking for the Ferrari 

Edited by Retouchguy

gjp it's photographers such as yourself, that many models are happy to make a compromise for if they're in a position to take a cut. You have a wonderful portfolio and a healthy dose of respect for models.

Canonphoto said

😱😱Gosh there’s some angry photographers on here 😱😱

Probably all now on assorted models' "Don't touch with a bargepole" list!

Gothic Image said

Canonphoto said

😱😱Gosh there’s some angry photographers on here 😱😱

Probably all now on assorted models' "Don't touch with a bargepole" list!

What you mean refusing paid work :-D

Retouchguy said

Gothic Image said

Canonphoto said

😱😱Gosh there’s some angry photographers on here 😱😱

Probably all now on assorted models' "Don't touch with a bargepole" list!

What you mean refusing paid work :-D

What makes you think those photographers would offer paid work?  ;-)

Gothic Image said

Retouchguy said

Gothic Image said

Canonphoto said

😱😱Gosh there’s some angry photographers on here 😱😱

Probably all now on assorted models' "Don't touch with a bargepole" list!

What you mean refusing paid work :-D

What makes you think those photographers would offer paid work?  ;-)

You never know :-D

Retouchguy said

Gothic Image said

Retouchguy said

Gothic Image said

Canonphoto said

😱😱Gosh there’s some angry photographers on here 😱😱

Probably all now on assorted models' "Don't touch with a bargepole" list!

What you mean refusing paid work :-D

What makes you think those photographers would offer paid work?  ;-)

You never know :-D

They'll probab;y have to pay "Feck Off Rates" as well.

Usually double.   ;)

The typical ad hominem attacks because people have the confidence to speak their mind. I take no insult from the whiteknight brigade. People support the same system that feeds them so they have to make sure they can be publicly seen to be doing that, I'm just glad I haven't fed the corrupt system as is by and large.

If you are a present day hobbyist photographer you are probably being mugged off.

Models you worst enemy is probably the photographers who look to belittle others. Some photographers need that to wise up though.

When you ask yourself why you are not getting booked look to the economy but also how photographers treat other photographers on forum.

It's one thing Chris Green was right about, as a forum there's a great bit of negativity. Though I very rarely use other forums so hard to compare.

Edited by Lenswonder